Talk:Emulation Speculation

alouor

Proposed deletion

As part of the cleanup project this page has been nominated for deletion. There are a few reasons for this.

• This page has not been kept up to date and some systems for which emulators have appeared haven't had their status changed.
• The whole article is speculative and can provide false 'hope' to new members or be misleading (they may believe things listed as likely are already being worked on or an emulator is already available though may be poor quality).
• It is too subjective and wrong in some cases. For example, the GameKing is listed as 'Likely' it is not likely that an emulator will ever be released for the GP2X, quite the opposite: it's extremely unlikely. There is currently no GameKing emulator capable of playing games, so the GP2X stands next to no chance of getting one. The page has turned into a page for speculating about the GP2X's power rather than the chances of emulators being released.
• Most of the article (possibly all of it) has been written by non-emulator developers or even by people who haven't programmed. This throws the validity of all the 'assumptions' into question as these people may not be qualified to make judgements on what can and can't be emulated.
• Some assumptions here have been proved incorrect in the past, such as Mega CD and GBA emulation.

Of course, I didn't expect to get away without simply deleting a fairly commonly used page without providing a substitute :). Therefore, I have written the Emulators page as a replacement. This is an unbiased, realistic and accurate (hopefully it will be up to date too) overview of emulation on the GP2X. It covers the fact that more modern systems are simply not able to be emulated on the GP2X without forming a huge list. It gives a quick bit of information about what you need to do to get emulators up and running and even explains what emulators are.

Also on the page is a list of all the systems that are emulated on the GP2X (or at least all I could find) partly taken from this page but mostly from the Archives, so should be pretty good (it certainly contains many more systems than this page). It also lists all emulators for each system to let the user make a judgement as to which is best for them (and also just for quick access to the information). It is a much slimmer page than this as it doesn't contain the commentaries (which are quite useless to be frank). Basically, it contains the same information as this page, but a lot more nicely written/laid out with much more extra information added.

This proposal is part of a wider project to clean up the wiki, removing outdated, poorly written, inaccurate (which is a major problem here since it is all speculation) or simply useless information as detailed on the Wiki Organization page. We are also trying to alter the tone to make it more formal and remove speculation (which this page is totally built upon) as it gives a bad impression and gives false hope to many people.

I'm going to set a deadline on this of Sunday June 10th 2007. Any objections must be added on this page, below this post and I shall consider whether to cancel the deletion (if it doesn't go ahead now, it will at some point in the future after the Emulators page is ready to take over, though I feel it is already). If the deletion does go ahead, this page will become a redirect to Emulators so that links/bookmarks still point to the same information.

Comments are appreciated!

Orkie 07:00, 6 June 2007 (PDT)

There is few to argue about the current page. Yet there is a demand for a page where to nail down what people think the gp2x hardware could handle / or which emulators still cry to be ported :) (not too many nowadays though). I'll propose a talk style page for that purpose and i'll eventually work on changing the page into one. -- StarG 07:37, 6 June 2007 (PDT)

I'm happy for you to do this as long as it's done fairly soon. I don't want the page hanging around in its current form for much longer and the purpose of the new page should be made totally clear. Orkie 12:48, 9 June 2007 (PDT)

Will any of the 'possiblity of emulation' information appear on the Emulators page? If so, I propose holding off a little until then, because once the page is deleted, only admins will be able to access the information, so any other users wanting to help out will have to recreate the data from scratch. If this is your intention, then sure, go ahead. :) Justthisguy 03:35, 7 June 2007 (PDT)

You really think I'm going to bastardise that beautifully written page with this stuff? ;) Orkie 03:53, 7 June 2007 (PDT)

I see :) Justthisguy 04:28, 7 June 2007 (PDT)

Keep the page until this afternoon - this should be enough to transform it -- StarG 17:56, 9 June 2007 (PDT)

PSX

Until you list the sources about the porting of the emulator and that the speed is roughly equal, it would be better to put the probability rating at "Somewhat likely". The Zodiac and GP2X are very different machines, and remember, this article is about *passable* emulation. Iignotus 16:14, 12 November 2005 (GMT)

Sega

32X sounds either "Very unlikely" or "Impossible". The machine had a couple of 32 bit processors running at 23Mhz and more than 6 other processors. This is taken from the Gens emulator readme file:

  For 32X emulation you will also need:
  Minimum System:                         Recommended System:
  * 800 Mhz CPU                            * 1 Ghz CPU
  * 32X bios files                         * 32X bios files"

Also, if nobody disagrees, the MegaCD/SegaCD should be added as "Somewhat likely" or "Likely". Segata 12:33, 12 November 2005 (GMT)

Mega-CD seems like it would be about as possible as 32x. If you can submit a couple links here that give a decent basis for needed speed for emulation on say, x86, then it may turn out much different. I'll add it now as Somewhat likely.

Iignotus 16:19, 12 November 2005 (GMT)

Again, you can check the Gens manual. http://gens.consolemul.com/. Its author recommends a P2-333Mhz for MegaCD and a 1 Ghz processor in order to emulate the 32X at fullspeed. Reesy himself said that emulating MegaCD would be possible. If this is not enough, we just need to have a look at both machines (http://www.emulator-zone.com/doc.php/genesis/. Emulating 2 32 bit processors running at 23Mhz, an extra VDP, extra sound hardware, etc. sounds, and is, a lot harder than emulating the MegaCD. This is why MegaCD seems more likely to be emulated. If you think the evidence i posted above is not enough, I'll gladly post more detailed information :)

Segata 21:59, 12 November 2005 (GMT)

Seems good to me; I was never too involved in the Sega Mega-CD. Other than the actual size of the ROM images, it seems that nothing is stopping an emulator from coming out. Thanks for the info and links.

Iignotus 00:28, 13 November 2005 (GMT)

I second that the suggestion that the 32x be moved to at least "Very unlikely" if not "Impossible", the Gens system requirements make a very clear case here.

Dijitao 15:38, 16 November 2005 (GMT)

Sega Saturn

Sunnan, the Saturn is "much hotter" than the PSX as its sound processor is a royal pain in the butt, among other things. The current state of Saturn emulation takes a > 1ghz p3 or athlon to get decent speeds. Until you can prove that there is any chance of getting Saturn emulation on the GP2X, I'm putting it back at "Impossible". Remember, this page is about *passable* emulation; it can't simply emulate the system at 0.1 fps.

In general, there is also not much interest in emulating the Saturn due to the difficulty; at least, compared to the interest and plethora of PSX emulators out there. SSF [1] is arguably the fastest Saturn emulator out there, and from that page you can see the kind of advanced computing it takes to acheive decent emulation. Furthermore, it is not open-source and relies on DirectX 9. It simply can't happen.

Iignotus 21:46, 16 November 2005 (GMT)

Thank you for clarifying this. Sunnan 01:44, 19 November 2005 (GMT)

SNK

If the NeoGeo CD sounds "very likely", why would MVS emulation "Unlikely"? Both machines had nearly the same hardware, and the GP2X has enough RAM to store even some of the big cartridges, if they're unencrypted. Segata 12:36, 12 November 2005 (GMT)

I completely agree, calling MVS emulation "Unlikely" while calling NeoGeo CD emulation very likely makes very little sense. Smaller games such as Puzzle Bobble should actually be easier to emulate on the MVS hardware then the NG-CD hardware because MP3 decoding won’t be necessary when emulating the MVS. The likelihood of emulating Garou Mark of the Wolves, or King of Fighters 2002 and beyond is “Unlikely” but overall the majority of NeoGeo MVS titles should be of similar difficulty to emulate as the NeoGeo CD. However given that there is already some evidence of successful emulation of the NeoGeo CD, the probability of the MVS being emulated is slightly lower, thus it should be changed to a status to “Somewhat likely"

Dijitao 15:18, 16 November 2005 (CST)

dosbox

I can't wait until someone tries dosbox on this machine!

It will run like a big pile of crap. Always. No matter what. Of course, it will be ported though.

Iignotus 20:22, 14 November 2005 (GMT)

Yes, x86, that crazy architecture! Maybe some text-games for the 8086 will run. Sunnan 02:45, 19 November 2005 (GMT)

• DOSbox has been ported, currently in v0.65, and 0.70 is in progress. Check the Wiki page or The Archives. --Super Jamie 01:05, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

Gameboy Advance

Is full speed emulation a possibility?

That is only possible with a from-scratch emulator, not a port of something like VBA. However, if an emulator were written from the ground-up to take full advantage of the GP2X's hardware, I see no reason why it wouldn't be full speed with sound after considerable optimisation.

Iignotus 04:14, 17 November 2005 (GMT)

If the Cpu used a virtualization type CPU emulation, i think it would be possible using VBA. though i know little of the process i do know you need to have a vast knowledge of the ARM7TDMI. if i recall correctly, the arm9 (the GP2X CPU)is backward compatable with the ARM7TDMI. (the GBA CPU).

of course, rewriting all the cpu hooks would be a royal pain in the ass.

Sephiroth111 5:20PM 2 January 2006 (EST)

Capcom Play System 1 & 2

What about CPS1 & CPS2 ? Is it possible (with MAME) ?

• CPS2 emu is already out, and plays at mostly fullspeed with good accuracy. A CPS1 emu has not yet been written. --Super Jamie 01:05, 25 March 2007 (PDT)

Mattel Intellivision

I would say "Definitely" for this one. Kyle Davis has an Intellivision emulator running on Treo 600s and 650s. My own Intellivision emulator (jzIntv) should also be easily retargetable to this platform. (Easiest if SDL gets ported, but reasonably possible even if it doesn't, since my dependencies to SDL are kept pretty well contained.) --Intvnut 23:19, 30 December 2005 (GMT)

MSX

Contrary to what the Emulation page suggests. MSX is -NOT- made by Microsoft.

The Ultimate MSX FAQ

The MSX Resource Center - THE Community site for non-Japanese MSX users.

MSX ASSOCIATION JAPAN - They hold the rights to 'MSX'.

Regards,

BodyHammeR

3DO

I put the 3DO emulator down as likely, given the comments of a 3DO emulator developer willing to port his. I took into account the likelyhood of getting players to donate to it as well. As for the system itself, the technology was created by the 3DO Company; Panasonic was only one of several manufacturers that licensed the technology.

--Jaguarandine

nokia ngage

I am a noob but my question is...

would the nokia ngage be possible?

--PAul

• the N-Gage and GP2x both share ARM-type processors, however, whilst the GP2x uses Linux as its' operating system, the NGage runs Symbian, so binaries wouldn't be directly compatible. One can port from DOS/Linux to GP2x, so I don't see why Symbian to GP2x would be any more or less difficult... --Super Jamie 01:03, 25 March 2007 (PDT)